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Forum Home: Yoga Teaching Subjects/Topics: Meditation:
how to deal with a wondering mind 		yoga teaching forum home for discussions between students and teachers

 
 


Rod
Administrator/ Moderator


Mar 16, 2004, 5:38 AM

Post #1 of 9 (7772 views)
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how to deal with a wondering mind Can't Post
hi everyone,

whilst surfing i found a couple of quotes , that would be of use to this age old topic, its a problem for many people, and can put many new meditators off and discourage them, your thoughts please on these would be greatly appreciated...

from Kashmir Shaivism ...
"Sit quietly and follow a natural breathing rhythm. Witness the different thoughts as they arise and subside in your mind. Let your mind spin as much as it wants. Do not try to subdue it. When thoughts or images arise, maintain an awareness of equality—the understanding that all objects are nothing but different forms of the Self. Even the worst thought is God.


Your goal is not to battle with the mind, but to witness it. Know that you, as the Self, are the witness, and let the mind go wherever it likes. Eventually, if you meditate with the awareness that “Whatever is, is God”, your mind will become calm and peaceful."


also from Sri Brahmarishi Narad

"If the attention wanders while practicing any of these meditation techniques, immediately bring the attention back to the process of meditation, and do this as many times as is necessary until the attention remains centered on the particular form of meditation which you are practicing. Inexperienced meditators have a tendency to fight distractions, which in itself, becomes a distraction. The attention can only dwell on one thing at a time. Simply bring it back to the thing you are meditating on. Another way of stopping distractions is simply to temporarily suspend the breathing process by neither breathing in or out. Since breathing is intimately tied to every biological process in the body, the instinct to survive (developed over billions of years of evolution) will interrupt the flow of attention into distractions and bring it to center on the awareness of the cessation of breathing. It is then an easy matter to resume normal breathing and to center the attention on the particular form of meditation being practiced. "


so i guess what im interested in is ...

should u allow the mind to wander as listed in the first quote, or should you concioussly "bring it back" everytime it does indeed wonder.( i cant imagine stopping the breathing being very pragmatic for meditators who find themselves constantly fighting a wondering mind on somedays)


once again thoughts and comments greatly appreciatedhow to deal with a wondering mind

Namaste,

Rod
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Yoga au
Yoga is a light; which, once lit, will never dim. The better your practice, the brighter the flame.
--BKS Iyengar



Bonnie
Forum Advanced Yogi


Apr 1, 2004, 5:12 PM

Post #2 of 9 (7753 views)
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Re: [Rod] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To

should u allow the mind to wander as listed in the first quote, or should you concioussly "bring it back" everytime it does indeed wonder.( i cant imagine stopping the breathing being very pragmatic for meditators who find themselves constantly fighting a wondering mind on somedays)

I find it often depends, I do a little of both sometimes I find sometimes I really need to "bring my mind back" and sometimes I find that the biggest distraction in meditation is "brinigng my mind back" sometimes if I let it wander it setles all by its self rather than me spending all the time thinking "no don't think about that" and "stop, concentrate, you are suposed to be meditating"

I guess the way I do it is to push out the big thoughts and to let the little ones wash over me, come in and flow out. The big thoughts tend to be things like what I am going to do when I have finished.... and.... what I did yesterday, little ones tend to be things little a noise I might notice or a fealing that is passing through me. Sometimes pushing these thoughts out take more out of my meditation.


Nadine
Yogi


Apr 6, 2004, 9:29 AM

Post #3 of 9 (7728 views)
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Re: [Bonnie] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
I'm like Bonnie - I do a little of both. I think you possibly develop a sense of which one will work in a particular situation. I think it's VERY important to observe to what the mind is wandering - obviously these are things that mind needs to purify and they provide good indicators of the sort of things you could be observing, aware of and studying in yourself.

If things get a bit out of hand and my mind is being a bit stubborn, I try to just keep the attention on the breath until the mind relaxes. Sometimes I use a mantra or an affirmation to give it something to occupy it til it's ready to let go of the dross and quieten down. This can take up to about 1/2 an hour at times.

I've been experimenting a bit with trataka (candle gazing) as a meditation/concentration practice. It adds a bit of variety to my practice. http://uk.geocities.com/deecammackyoga/frametrataka.html


Bonnie
Forum Advanced Yogi


Apr 6, 2004, 2:35 PM

Post #4 of 9 (7725 views)
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Re: [Nadine] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
How do you find candle gazing?? I seem to forget to blink and my eyes get watery and sore. Any sugestions??


Nadine
Yogi


Apr 7, 2004, 8:06 AM

Post #5 of 9 (7719 views)
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Re: [Bonnie] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Bonnie - It's not easy - when my eyes get tired I close them for a while and try to retain the image behind my eyelids. Generally I have trouble with this - the image just isnt there - but I reckon with practice it will improve. When my eyes feel rested I go back to the gazing thing.


Bonnie
Forum Advanced Yogi


Apr 7, 2004, 3:29 PM

Post #6 of 9 (7716 views)
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Re: [Nadine] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
see I can't do that, the minuite I close my eyes any visual image I had is gone on account of my having a very very poor visual memory.


rachael
Yogi

Apr 8, 2004, 1:31 PM

Post #7 of 9 (7711 views)
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Re: [Bonnie] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
Hey Bonnie,

would it be possible, given that you may be more auditory than visual, to try focussing on listeing to something, a piece of music, chanting? It was just a thought but it seems to involve the same idea of concentration, just using a different sense.


Janet
Yogi / Moderator


Jun 8, 2004, 3:44 PM

Post #8 of 9 (6423 views)
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Re: [Bonnie] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi all,
Great chat about the 'wandering mind'. Re: Trataka (candle gazing)... Trataka is a Kriya, and as such is a cleansing process, the eyes are supposed to water - this is part of the cleansing.
Check out http://www.dhyansanjivani.org/meditation_on_flame.asp for more information.
I adore trataka with a candle flame... one of my favourite meditation practices.

In terms of the wandering mind, if the goal is to move from Dharana (single pointed focus) to Dhyana (meditation) then it is necessary to slow the mind as mich as possible, moving away from the monkey-mind which swings irratically between thoughts / images / memories / ideas / desires, and eventually to move beyond the mind.

I find bringing the attention to the breath, folllowing the breath, to be a really effective way to slow the thoughts, to quieten the mind, and to move into meditation... sometimes!!!
_________________________________________________
Seize life with both hands... and plant a great big KISS on her forehead!


Rod
Administrator/ Moderator


Aug 30, 2004, 4:15 PM

Post #9 of 9 (5049 views)
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Re: [Rod] how to deal with a wondering mind [In reply to] Can't Post
The way to train the mind when it is restless is to first acknowledge that, for this moment, the mind is simply not going to sit still. Therefore, we give it something to do, but something internal, not external.

Focus on what is there, not some new fantasy: Also, we focus on something which is already there, not creating yet another fantasy in the mind. This is part of the beauty of the various Yoga "relaxations" (such as below); they focus on what "is" within our own body and being.
When we have accepted that the mind is restless, and are giving it something to do internally, that is reality based, then the next question is the speed at which the mind is allowed to move.

Slowly or quickly surveying: If the mind is restless, and you tell it to sit still, it fights. But if you let in move at a comfortable pace, it will be happy. Moving your attention from one "part" to another (shoulder, arm, wrist, etc.) can be too slow for the restless mind. Speeding up the rate of surveying can have a comfortable effect on the mind.

Think of times that you and a friend were walking somewhere, when you wanted to walk at different speeds, one fast, and the other slow. It is the same principle with attention or "relaxation" exercises; find the proper rate to move the attention, which is a bit faster when the mind is restless.
So, with the restless mind:
  • Accept that it is restless.
  • Don't just divert it; practice self-awareness and self-training.
  • Give the mind an internal travel plan of where to journey.
  • Speed up the rate at which attention moves through the points of focus.
  • Remember to breath smoothly, quietly, with no jerks or pauses, and at a comfortable, somewhat slow rate.


Namaste,

Rod
_________________
Yoga au
Yoga is a light; which, once lit, will never dim. The better your practice, the brighter the flame.
--BKS Iyengar


 
 
 


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